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NewYork90 52F  
125 posts
1/28/2019 12:18 am
When is a limit a limit and when can those boundaries be pushed?

One of the first questions I am always asked is “What are your limits?” or the other variation “What are your hard limits?” And we see so many places where people talk about “pushing a sub’s limits/boundaries”.

So when is a limit a limit and when can they be pushed? Are hard limits, and limits the same thing, or is there a subtle distinction?

Thinking back to when I first realized I was a sub and began with my first Dom, limits to me were things I had not experienced, but on becoming aware of certain activities, felt they did not resonate with me, scared me, or the idea repulsed me based on the moral standing I had at the time. So I had a list of “limits” based on that criteria.

My Dom accepted this and understood where I was coming from at that point in my life. He did not push me into something on that list. He did however dance around some of them. Watching my reaction and then discussing it with me. Slowly my mind was opening to new possibilities and to a deeper understanding of D/s. Little by little “limits” were removed from my list by me and I found enjoyment in activities I would never have guessed I would. At the end of our time together – 3 years – my limits were now what I would call “hard limits”. Those things that at my core I felt were not healthy for my personality to engage in.

So what changed was me, I knew myself more as a sub, I had experienced more and understood my Dom and trusted him. Trying something I thought was a limit with him did not mean I had to remove it from my list unless I was ready to do so. Conversely I knew he would not ask me to do something on that list unless I told him I was ready. If it was not a good experience it could go back on the list. No judgement , no reprisals. There was always a respect between us that allowed for this openness of dialogue.

There are some things that will forever remain on my “list” and will never be tried. As I grow in maturity in my role as a sub and encounter new experiences I may find I will add to that. To me the “list” is a fluid document and will evolve based on where you are in your journey.

What are your thoughts on this?

Do your limits change over time or do they remain the same?
Do limits remain the same
Do limits change over time


NewYork90 52F  
161 posts
1/28/2019 12:27 am

I hope this subject open up a dialogue about limits and boundaries. I would appreciate hearing your thoughts on the subject.


jenny14 69T  
69111 posts
1/28/2019 1:40 am

NY

My Hard Limits stay unchanged but I am open-minded to explore new things...

A life spent making mistakes is not only more honorable, but more useful than a life spent doing nothing. George Bernard Shaw

Jenny


NewYork90 replies on 1/28/2019 9:51 am:
That is such a good point, thank you for sharing

sub_nouveau 49F  
9623 posts
1/28/2019 2:33 am

I practice the same philosophy re limits as you do. There are my "hard" limits which are non-negotiable and will never change - things that I am absolutely morally or innately opposed to - and no matter how much I trust & love my partner, if he were ever to attempt to introduce those things - that would be the end of us.

Then there are my "for now" limits - those things that I'm not immediately ready for, but am willing to try as our connection and trust in each other develops. And there needs to be lots of discussion and preparation, before I'll agree to drop any of my "for now" limits. Examples include knife play; piss play; inviting another to join us; etc. Things that require a deep level of trust.

Let's talk. It's how we learn about yesterday and comprehend today.


NewYork90 replies on 1/28/2019 9:53 am:
I like the terms you used of Hard limits and For Now limits. Someone new will benefit from you insight. thank you for responding.

looking4fat 67T  
126 posts
1/28/2019 3:38 am

Yes. My "limits" can vary depending on the Man i am serving at the time. My level of comfort and trust can allow me to try some things that i normally would not do.


But my "hard limits" remain the same: No Blood, No Poop, No Piercing, No Marks, and No "Safe Words." "No" means NO. My safe words are things like "No" and "stop" and "don't." i have always felt that "safe words" are for role players. My words and limits are for real life.


i have tried to spell all that out clearly in my profile. But you know how most members are about reading, "I'll look at the purty pi'chures now an' read that stuff later." and "later" never comes.


My "gurl name" is Kate Coxuker. It is who i am and what i do.


NewYork90 replies on 1/28/2019 9:55 am:
Interesting perspective and a very valid one, some limits can change depending on the level of trust you have from person to person.

Knottyash73 50M  
21 posts
1/28/2019 4:23 am

I firmly believe that limits should be adhered to. The sub sets these at the outset. She calls the shots initially. The dom then operates within those parameters so she can relax and enjoy what comes her way. Limits would only be explored as and when she was ready. The paradox of a d/s relationship or is that the dom operates in accordance with his subs predefined wishes....Always. So that brings us to another question....who is really in charge.


NewYork90 replies on 1/28/2019 9:56 am:
Your answer pricked my brain and has given me food for thought for a future blog: Who is in charge here? thank you.

sletje1999 19F  
10 posts
1/28/2019 5:21 am

When someone asks me about my limits I assume he means the hard limits, and yes they are not likely to change. Then there are the imits that I simply have because I don't feel ready to try them and sometimes it can be even something that changes from day to day. especially depending on the dom. For someone I just met recently I'm not likely to go anywhere that doesn't feel fully comfortable from the start, with someone I know for a longer time I'm more willing to have those non-hard limits tested a bit.


NewYork90 replies on 1/28/2019 9:58 am:
You bring up a good point in comfort level. It does make a difference in the boundaries you set. Thank you for that addition to the conversation.

yourpleasure42 72M  
202 posts
1/28/2019 5:21 am

My sub sets the limits. Then we go from there. There are limits that I wouldn't want to agree with. Who likes this and who likes that. It's a 50/50 arrangement.


NewYork90 replies on 1/28/2019 10:01 am:
Thank you for a slightly different view on this, both people are involved and have limits. Great addition to this conversation.

VladVampireLord 45M  
13505 posts
1/28/2019 6:25 am

De do do do de da da da
Is all I want to say to you
De do do do de da da da
Their innocence will pull me through
De do do do de da da da
Is all I want to say to you
De do do do de da da da
They're meaningless and all that's true

You can't escape the wrath of my heart...


NewYork90 replies on 1/28/2019 10:04 am:
As usual you present a musical and unique contribution to the conversation. Thank you.

aliljaded 48F  
1494 posts
1/28/2019 8:40 am

My soft limits change with time. He pushes them, which I am grateful for. But my hard limits never change. Thanks for the great topic.

"Men need to hunt. She obviously understands this. She’s offering herself as prey. Not easy prey. But willing.”


NewYork90 replies on 1/28/2019 10:05 am:
Thank you for participating. Topics like this help everyone and I appreciate your contribution to that.

Jag_60 60M  
1070 posts
1/28/2019 10:46 am

Testing limits is what makes BDSM viable, once you have reached a plateau of unbndled adrenaline, endorphins and europhia if you have to ramp up your likes to achieve that outcome you will do so. Had limits are as mallalable and tend to be vibrant vows against certain acts of intimacy that are etched in stone.


NewYork90 replies on 1/28/2019 11:54 am:
Your comment about intensity having an effect on limits being changed is a good one, but with hard limits remaining.

Motophoto11 55M  
7 posts
1/28/2019 12:49 pm

Limits are an interesting term. There are things that are simply put a no I wont even consider doing that, i.e. scat, kids, animals ect, then there are what some call limits of what a sub can do. This is where many get confused and have a hard time understanding. Ultimately a sub can stop any scene, however, a good Dom knows how to work a sub into different tolerances for things. Take flogging for an example, a basic and simple part of a scene, Most subs tend to start out are a level of intensity that in time increases. Their Dom, works them past the "limit" of how long, how much, what type of flogging they can handle. They progress into different types of flogging and types of floggers, they get past a "limit" Same thing applies to paddling and spanking, the Dom has to be experienced enough to know where and when to work into a new level of intensity, and then guide the sub to where they can get too. Impact play with spanking and paddling can develop over time. There are levels of what a sub can actually endure and learn they like. I have known subs who loved spanking, that expanded into a paddle, which moved slowing into a hard crop, ect ect. Each sub has their own peak threshold where they can't go further. It is the Dom who has to kow how to bring that out for them and help the sub grow.
I can cite many other examples of this, where the level of intensity increases, this is what many term a "limit". There are also new experiences a sub many never have explored, or had someone experienced enough to explore with. For example, rope bondage, while some have a basic ability to tie, there are many various ways to correctly tie a sub. This can eventually lead to suspension bondage, again if the Dom has the knowledge and experience to know how to properly fly their sub. For example the play space I have in my home has hard points that can fly any sub, and many subs at first are a little scared of trying to leave the ground. The sub begins to trust their Dom as they do different ties and have more trust in their Dom. They are slowly introduced to being off the ground and their level of a limit for bondages increases. This opens up a new horizon for a sub and they begin to grow in their submission and nature.
BDSM isa wide range of things. A D/sM/s relationship needs growth a sub will crave this and a Dom will want to see the depth of their sub. In the 36 years I have been a Dom, I have seen many subs who are far more able to do certain things than they thought they could. Limits are a vague term, there are those things people call a hard limit, and then there are levels that some call limits. I have seen many of my sub over the years each different levels in different areas of bdsm, some were very surprised to learn just what they liked and what could actually make them excited, their previous doms merely scratched a surface that was never explored in depth.


NewYork90 replies on 1/28/2019 1:03 pm:
I am very thankful for your excellent response. There is much here for people to think about and learn from.

dirty_biker 52M  
13 posts
1/29/2019 1:16 am

    Quoting Knottyash73:
    I firmly believe that limits should be adhered to. The sub sets these at the outset. She calls the shots initially. The dom then operates within those parameters so she can relax and enjoy what comes her way. Limits would only be explored as and when she was ready. The paradox of a d/s relationship or is that the dom operates in accordance with his subs predefined wishes....Always. So that brings us to another question....who is really in charge.
Great question, who is really in charge? Ultimately, in a trusting relationship it is the sub, and of course if those limits are pushed a bit too far there is always the risk of falling into the non-consent area which could end with legal complications...


NewYork90 replies on 2/1/2019 11:06 am:
You bring up the eternal question about how each of these roles are so contingent on each other, one cannot fully exist without the other. Thank you for your comments.

rosaenaluin 59F  
2729 posts
1/29/2019 6:36 am

Great reactions, i too know i have some hard limits and some soft limits.
I even know that it is possible to make hard limits into soft limits....it scares the livingday light out of some
When you are in a Total Authority transfer kind of dynamic, you dont have hard limits, although it is wise to start with them.trust and communicationis key.


rosaenaluin 59F  
2729 posts
1/29/2019 6:40 am

Oh,and the dom should 'work' with in the bounderies the sub provides


NewYork90 replies on 1/29/2019 12:07 pm:
I appreciate your point of view and the points you make, Thank yo for sharing,

Dreamcatcher__ 82M
5228 posts
1/29/2019 9:26 pm

My objective is always to gradually introduce my submissive to the delights of becoming an odalisque, my pleasure slave. This shouldn't include anything she might find objectionable, as long as she is amenable to the conversion. This generally involves some compromise initially as we explore each others' preferences, and discover where the hard limits actually lie and accept them. I have generally encountered little resistance, since pleasure involves fulfillment and mutual satisfaction, and seldom includes anything that might be disagreeable to a true submissive.


NewYork90 replies on 1/29/2019 10:39 pm:
I appreciate you rinput and observations, some really good point made

JJJayJr 71M  
181 posts
1/30/2019 8:27 pm

Thank you for this --excellent.


NewYork90 replies on 2/1/2019 11:07 am:
Thank you for taking the time to join in the conversation.

VladVampireLord 45M  
13505 posts
1/31/2019 5:42 am

No problem.

I got to have a shot
Of what you got
It's oh so sweet
You got to make it hot
Like a boomerang I need a repeat
Gimme all your lovin'
All your hugs and kisses too
Gimme all your lovin'
Don't let up until we're through

You can't escape the wrath of my heart...


linda39be 53F  
4 posts
1/31/2019 6:46 am

It is adifficult subject. Personally I adhere to hard limits because I am not really a submissive or maso but an exhibitionist. I love to arouse men watching me being used in various ways. SM is the most effective way to get men into radiating lust. So taking it just that one step further just for their pleasure...that one notch on the Erostek, those 5 extra minutes on the wooden horse, that little bit of extra weight… well, it works for me


NewYork90 replies on 2/1/2019 11:08 am:
Your insights and comments are very much appreciated. Thank you for your participation.

SteelyEyedMan 40M
5 posts
1/31/2019 11:25 am

To each their own. Limits often change over time.


NewYork90 replies on 2/1/2019 11:09 am:
This is an important conversation and I appreciate you joining in.

IAmLordUnicron 41M
1 post
2/1/2019 12:58 pm

Interesting topic.

I favor the concept of "structured revisitation" in my dynamics. That is, we negotiate initial hard and soft limits and boundaries. Moving on, at set times (usually quarterly) we sit down for a metatalk and discuss how those limits and the underlying perceptions which shape them have changed.

As a Dominant, one of my duties is to push the sub's boundaries and limits in a SAFE manner. This means "nibbling at the edges," not a brute-force attack! If anal is a soft limit (e.g. won't trigger a panic attack but it's not my all-time favorite), for example, I might stroke the area lightly during a full-body massage and gauge her responses while talking to her. "Does that feel nice? Would you like me to do more of that?" If the answer is yes to both, I proceed. If the answer is no, I don't. "Yes, it feels good but don't go any deeper/harder" is a clear signal of desire, so we wash, rinse and repeat with variations as appropriate. "No, it doesn't feel nice but I want you to do more of it!" will certainly raise some questions about the sub's mental and emotional state!

I have noticed in my dynamics that SOME limits and boundaries tend to shift over time. One popular theme is that of blowjobs. "Sucking cock gives me panic attacks. I'll suck your cock but you can't cum in my mouth. I'll suck your cock but you can't cum on my face." Etc.

In many (not all, but many) cases, I've found the solution to this problem is to let the sub take point, encouraging but not forcing her to go just a little further, and praise her lavishly during and after for her bravery and talent. "You're such a good little slut, look at you taking my cock all the way to the balls like a trooper." "You were a very brave little whore to do that. I know it was uncomfortable for you and it pleased me immensely to watch you face your fear and do it anyway." Positive feedback usually yields positive results, and in nearly every case I've experienced, inspires the submissive to work toward overcoming the next hurdle, etc. So if she can take my cock to the hilt regularly, she may want to work up to adjusting to the taste and texture, allowing me cum in her mouth or on her face, swallowing and so on, always with the understanding that if it's too much, everything stops immediately.

Thus, at the next scheduled metatalk re: boundaries, the sub is often surprised to learn their limits and boundaries have shifted well away from where they were! Seeing the pride and joy in their eyes from overcoming those limits through their own efforts and resources is hugely gratifying to me. In some cases, soft limits have become typical Tuesdays, hard limits have morphed to soft ones. However, some limits are immutable and/or dangerous even to contemplate testing. In these cases, I don't and won't.

Thank you for the interesting conversation, and my apologies for the somewhat windy dissection!


NewYork90 replies on 2/18/2019 5:06 pm:
Thank you for your insight and comments. They added a lot to the conversation and brought up goods points regarding how "limits" can morph over time.

gutterpig 55F  
1 post
2/1/2019 1:15 pm

I totally understand where you are coming from. It seems like I could have wrote this myself, as my list of limits was long compared to what they are now. It takes your trust in the Dom to communicate your fears and find out why they are on that list. And it takes that same trust for the sub to move it or keep it there. Ultimately it is the subs decision.

Thank you for sharing


NewYork90 replies on 2/18/2019 5:07 pm:
I appreciate your joining in the conversation and reinforcing the element that trust plays in this.

bobnuotatore69 49M
1 post
2/18/2019 3:03 pm

I had really a few limits since from the start but those remained


NewYork90 replies on 2/18/2019 5:08 pm:
Your involvement in the conversation on your perspective are appreciated.


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